2006-05-03 11:29![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
nightrythm
nightrythmI know various people on my flist have been discussing the current immigration issues. As a second generation American, I feel the need to put in my two cents.
A) If your argument is that that illegal aliens are breaking the law and breaking the law is wrong. Then so be it. I do not quibble with you. Although, I don’t believe it should be a *felony* as in the current bill in DC. If they want to have greater consequences, they should try *enforcing* the law as it stands. Toughening the law will do a fat lot of good.
B) To the folks who didn’t understand the protests. Or are indignant that anyone should “boycott”… I heard a comment on CNN that went something like this: ‘We should have a day without an American, where we deny illegal aliens healthcare, social services etc.’ – I’d like to say that the immigrants understand what it is the America does for them, that’s why they come here. The reason they staged “A day without an immigrant” was to try to have Americans understand what immigrants do for America.
C) My family history as an example of a typical immigrant’s story. I hope it helps you see that they are no more a drain on the system than anyone else in their economic class.
My grandmother crossed illegally, as I believe did my grandfather. They worked hard all their lives, in fields and factories. Their children were born here and also worked hard all their lives. While my mother was young, they were itinerant farm workers. She was too small to do the big lifting, but even my mother picked the fallen fruit from the ground.
My uncles fought in the Korean war. All of my mothers older siblings are conservative and *most likely* vote Republican. (It’s something we don’t talk about anymore – leads to too many arguments.)
To sum up two people crossed illegally. They had four children who have done nothing but give to this country. Each successive generation are steadfastly American, most of them are so assimilated, they barely remember Spanish. The taxes they have paid collectively vastly outweigh any government graft someone may have gotten and I consistently fail to see where they have hurt any pre-existing American Citizens by pursuing the “American Dream”.
A) If your argument is that that illegal aliens are breaking the law and breaking the law is wrong. Then so be it. I do not quibble with you. Although, I don’t believe it should be a *felony* as in the current bill in DC. If they want to have greater consequences, they should try *enforcing* the law as it stands. Toughening the law will do a fat lot of good.
B) To the folks who didn’t understand the protests. Or are indignant that anyone should “boycott”… I heard a comment on CNN that went something like this: ‘We should have a day without an American, where we deny illegal aliens healthcare, social services etc.’ – I’d like to say that the immigrants understand what it is the America does for them, that’s why they come here. The reason they staged “A day without an immigrant” was to try to have Americans understand what immigrants do for America.
C) My family history as an example of a typical immigrant’s story. I hope it helps you see that they are no more a drain on the system than anyone else in their economic class.
My grandmother crossed illegally, as I believe did my grandfather. They worked hard all their lives, in fields and factories. Their children were born here and also worked hard all their lives. While my mother was young, they were itinerant farm workers. She was too small to do the big lifting, but even my mother picked the fallen fruit from the ground.
My uncles fought in the Korean war. All of my mothers older siblings are conservative and *most likely* vote Republican. (It’s something we don’t talk about anymore – leads to too many arguments.)
To sum up two people crossed illegally. They had four children who have done nothing but give to this country. Each successive generation are steadfastly American, most of them are so assimilated, they barely remember Spanish. The taxes they have paid collectively vastly outweigh any government graft someone may have gotten and I consistently fail to see where they have hurt any pre-existing American Citizens by pursuing the “American Dream”.
◾ Tags:
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
(no subject)
I think the best "immigration reform" this country can enact is to apply the same standards to everyone entering the country, no matter where they come from. And felonizing illegal entry is pointless, not to mention wasteful, as it diverts law enforcement resources away from other, real crimes.
(no subject)
If we only had a couple different rulese to follow as opposed to over 100, we could then dedicate immigration staff to processing what's there rather than trying to decipher which rules apply when.
(no subject)
I don't think felonizing is a good idea either. But I don't support amnesty. Why should these illegals get a leg up in the line over all the folks trying to follow the rules properly?
I also agree that enforcement of the law should be stepped up. Those that hire illegals should be punished. If that happened, then they'd work on fixing the entry issue, to avoid the fines, and the illegal entry would decline.
But I also don't see how we could enforce the laws "properly" and deport 11 or 20 million people.
(no subject)
I must agree with
(no subject)
(no subject)
This issue isn't an easy one to deal with. And I think at the moment we are just looking at the opening volleys from to opposing views. Hopefully we will find a middle road that both sides can agree on and that is fair to those who have come here both legally and illegally.
The fact is that some people have come here illegally and there should be some repercussions. The fact is that many families could be drastically impacted by heavy fines or extradition and that does need to be taken into consideration in any new laws or amendments to existing laws.
(no subject)
(no subject)
Maybe Plato had it correct. Maybe we should only give power to those who don't desire it.
(no subject)
(no subject)
(no subject)
B)i understood the protest... i am just... well...
i will first say (as i mentioned in my own journal) i respect wholeheartedly how it was done. I applaud those that led it and suggested and reminded of non violence and such. My issue is similar to the issue i had with a demonstration that happened at Occidental College. to demonstrate the impact aids has had on the Artistic community so they had a day without art and covered up anything that remotely looked like art. but not all art comes from people with aids, they should have done a percentage of the art, not all of it.
since the issue is with illegal immigrants, not immigrants in general, having immigrants not show up to work doesn't change my opinion on anything. I RECOGNIZE how valuable legal immigrants are. so i thought it a bad representation of what we would lose if we stopped illegal immigrants from coming in. the minute legal immigrants are joining that cause, it becomes about all immigration and i have no problem with the legal stuff. it muddies the issue from where i am sitting. i could be wrong, but that is what i got from it.
and as for your C
i would cry at the thought of not have you here (even though you are planning some horrible revenge on me at faire) i am GLAD your grandparents came over illegally in the same way i would be glad for any stealing or what have you my ancestors did to get by (c'mon, they were irish, i am sure one or two things were not on the up and up) and stay alive so that i could be here today. That is past, and i never hold people accountable for their ancestors actions. this doesn't mean i am going to condone that same action today. people will do what they can to get by, and i will never think them less of a person for trying so. i just figure that you accept the possibility of punishment when you do something against the rules. I know many that choose what laws they wish to follow. FOr example, people who feel that Pot should be legal. If they get caught, i expect them to do the time or pay the fine or what have you, even though i agree that it should be legal. if i am caught speeding in an area that i believe 70 to be a safe speed, i will still pay the ticket, as my opinion of what is right is not the accepted law. if i feel strongly enough about a law, i have been known to write letters and speak with congressmen and see what legal channels i can use to change the law, but if i break the law in the mean time, i will accept the punishment.
love you, xana!
(no subject)
now I feel that your family's story is likely a typical scenerio. I think one of the problems is that we have created this negetive conitation with illegals being mainly criminals and lazy people or that they are taking away jobs from people who wanted them.
Personally I think on these words when it comes to the issue:
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me"
~Emma Lazarus, "The New Colossus," 1883.
We had the same arguments when the irish were coming over and with many other imagrants. This country was made great by people coming here to start a new life.
Here is my issue with illegal aliens.
Some statistics (stolen from the World Events section of Laughingplace.com)
http://rogerhedgecock.com/cont
ent/view/421/61/
>>ROGER'S MOST REQUESTED ITEM FROM LISTENERS IS POSTED HERE!
These points are from various LA Times articles
From the L.A Times
1. 40% of all workers in L.A. County (L.A. County has 10 million people) are working for cash and not paying taxes. This was because they are predominantly illegal immigrants, working without a green card.
2. 95% of warrants for murder in Los Angeles are for illegal aliens.
http://www.washingtontimes.com
/op-ed/20040119-082933-4484r.htm
3. 75% of people on the most wanted list in Los Angeles are illegal aliens.
4. Over 2/3's of all births in Los Angeles County are to illegal alien Mexicans on Medi-Cal whose births were paid for by taxpayers.
5. Nearly 25% of all inmates in California detention centers are Mexican nationals here illegally.
6. Over 300,000 illegal aliens in Los Angeles County are living in garages.
7. The FBI reports half of all gang members in Los Angeles are most likely illegal aliens from south of the border.
8. Nearly 60% of all occupants of HUD properties are illegal.
9. 21 radio stations in L.A. are Spanish speaking.
10. In L.A.County 5.1 million people speak English. 3.9 million speak Spanish (10.2 million people in L.A.County).
(All 10 from the Los Angeles Times)
Less than 2% of illegal aliens are picking our crops but 29% are on welfare.
http://www.cis.org
Over 70% of the United States annual population growth (and over 90% of California, Florida, and New York) results from immigration.
The cost of immigration to the American taxpayer in 1997 was a NET (after subtracting taxes immigrants pay) $70 BILLION a year, [Professor Donald Huddle, Rice University].
29% of inmates in federal prisons are illegal aliens.
Re: Here is my issue with illegal aliens.
snopes responds...
http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/taxes.asp
Re: Here is my issue with illegal aliens.
You're citing a message board for Disney fans, a conservative "newspaper" founded by Reverend Sung Myung Moon, and a conservative think tank, founded by John Tanton, which isn't just anti-illegal immigrant, but anti-immigrant.
These are not people who's numbers I would give any credence to. Find me statistics in the LA Times, Wall Street journal or US Government web page(for example) and I'll certainly take it into consideration.